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ggrobot
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 Posted: Tue Dec 02, 2014 1:53 am Post subject: Denuvo DRM System Has Been Cracked [38589] |
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3DM has reported that it's been able to crack the latest DRM system, Denuvo, that was used in FIFA 15, Lords of the Fallen and Dragon Age: Inquisition. Some users claimed that Denuvo was responsible for damaging their SSDs, while others claimed that Lords of the Fallen's performance issues were due to this particular D
Read more...
Source: GGMania headlines
GGMania.com - Daily Gaming and Tech news |
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Csimbi
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Joined: 05 Mar 2010
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Location: The bright side of the dark side
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| Posted: Tue Dec 02, 2014 2:00 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | After 15 days of work, the 64bit version of Denuvo has been cracked |
That was quick.
I hope it demonstrates how stupid these DRMs are.
They should invest all that money in making games better so they are worth buying.
Last edited by Csimbi on Tue Dec 02, 2014 10:47 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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gx-x
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| Posted: Tue Dec 02, 2014 5:23 pm Post subject: |
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of course it didn't boost sales...It's the welfare distribution difference problem. If I say I cannot afford a game, someone from USA will tell me "that's bullshit, you can afford PC, you can afford a game". Yea right. I save over the year to be able to do one upgrade next year. If one works for 200-300$/month, working for western companies that are happy to NOT PAY 2000$+ in their native countries, how can I shell out 50-60$ for a game? Food and electricity cost the same in USA and in Bulgaria, or China or w/e.
You just can't force those "underprivileged" people to buy stuff like that.
They might save up for a 250$ GPU upgrade but that's it, it takes a year of savings.
A lot of people can't even do that, no matter how much they want to. Hell, most people I know change tires once every 5-6 years, they swap front and back ones after the 2nd year and that's it. Most of them would rather buy a pair of tires than a game, and they cost the same. |
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Tom
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Joined: 07 Jun 2004
Posts: 4289
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| Posted: Tue Dec 02, 2014 7:45 pm Post subject: |
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| gx-x wrote: | of course it didn't boost sales...It's the welfare distribution difference problem. If I say I cannot afford a game, someone from USA will tell me "that's bullshit, you can afford PC, you can afford a game". Yea right. I save over the year to be able to do one upgrade next year. If one works for 200-300$/month, working for western companies that are happy to NOT PAY 2000$+ in their native countries, how can I shell out 50-60$ for a game? Food and electricity cost the same in USA and in Bulgaria, or China or w/e.
You just can't force those "underprivileged" people to buy stuff like that.
They might save up for a 250$ GPU upgrade but that's it, it takes a year of savings.
A lot of people can't even do that, no matter how much they want to. Hell, most people I know change tires once every 5-6 years, they swap front and back ones after the 2nd year and that's it. Most of them would rather buy a pair of tires than a game, and they cost the same. |
I agree, games are a ripoff, I buy way less than I used too and that's why I don't own a console anymore. Most of the games now are digital. You use your own internet to get them and store them. What did game dev's do, pfft, raised prices. Any game, I don't care what it is. If it's over $60 they can blow me. More people need attitudes like me, when they release games and nobody buys them, then they will lower prices. It's all greed. It's all very sad. |
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lorcro2000
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Joined: 23 Jan 2007
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| Posted: Tue Dec 02, 2014 10:48 pm Post subject: |
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I disagree that games are a ripoff. You get more entertainment time out of a game than you do almost any other form of entertainment, like movies. And with high-end games, the development process is massive - like Dragon Age Inquisition, it's full of enormous amounts of voice acting and art, none of that is free (though it should be).
That said, they are a luxury, and you have to be very well off to be able to buy all the games, and movies, and music, and books that you want, for someone who consumes a lot of entertainment it adds up to huge amounts. So people have to pick and choose.
Between going to the movies or buying a game, people often choose the movie - and then pirate the game.
I've never believed that all "lost sales" from piracy exist; copying has always been about getting something you won't pay for, so who really loses? |
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Csimbi
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| Posted: Tue Dec 02, 2014 10:49 pm Post subject: |
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| Tom wrote: | | Any game, I don't care what it is. If it's over $60 they can blow me. More people need attitudes like me, when they release games and nobody buys them, then they will lower prices. It's all greed. It's all very sad. |
Ditto. My limit is $10 though, $3 for older games.
| lorcro2000 wrote: | | Between going to the movies or buying a game, people often choose the movie - and then pirate the game. |
Obviously, because you will want to pay for experiencing the movie in a theater. Most likely you won't be going alone and you won't be going only to see the movie; there are a whole lot of other things that make up that experience.
There's no "experience" to pay for when it comes to games on a computer as most of the time you're alone in a dark room. You're just killing your free time. In the pre-digital distribution era, at least you had a nice box to touch, smell and show to your friend. You don't have any of that today. No memories to walk away with, nothing to talk about when you grow older.
| lorcro2000 wrote: | | I've never believed that all "lost sales" from piracy exist; copying has always been about getting something you won't pay for, so who really loses? |
There is a lost sale when you convert a customer into a potential customer. (A guy who used to buy games for $60 now buys games for $3 on the street. I should know, I bought hundreds of movies on Amazon. Later on, in China, on DVD; they were $1 each on the street while they were $15-25 on Amazon. I watched them and then I have thrown them away - and I bought only the good movies on Amazon.)
But. Let's pause here for a moment. You should consider who buys games. IMHO, it's mostly kids (below age 21) from their dads' money. As these kids grow older, daddy ceases to supply pocket money. The kid will have buy games from his own money. To do that, he needs to earn money. When he earns money, most likely, in the process, he will have learned how hard it is to earn his money. At that point, he won't be buying the games anymore. So what happens at that point? Well, some of these kids do turn pirates, yes. But the majority of these kids grows up and gives up gaming as a whole. |
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Tom
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| Posted: Wed Dec 03, 2014 12:22 am Post subject: |
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| Csimbi wrote: | | Tom wrote: | | Any game, I don't care what it is. If it's over $60 they can blow me. More people need attitudes like me, when they release games and nobody buys them, then they will lower prices. It's all greed. It's all very sad. |
Ditto. My limit is $10 though, $3 for older games. |
Same here bud. Most I buy anymore is $10 or lower. Maybe I'll shed $20 but my days of spending $60+ for a game, way way long gone. Movies, I haven't seen a movie in a theater in over a year. I'm not paying that ridiculous price either. I wait until it's online.  Ya know what, the movie companies in Canada are going under because a lot of other people aren't interested in paying $60+ to take the family to a movie. |
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gx-x
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| Posted: Wed Dec 03, 2014 12:29 am Post subject: |
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| 60$+? o.O I thought movie tickets are like ~5$/person ?! Damn...Honestly, I wait for BR HD rips on trackers. Too many times have I walked out of the cinema in the middle of a movie...(I would pay like ~5$ to watch a movie on netflix or w/e but I don't have access to such a service) |
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Csimbi
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| Posted: Wed Dec 03, 2014 10:48 am Post subject: |
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| gx-x wrote: | | 60$+? o.O I thought movie tickets are like ~5$/person ?! |
The company gave us cine tickets for $3.
But you need to add gas, tickets, popcorn, drinks, poutine, etc. It adds up. | gx-x wrote: | | Too many times have I walked out of the cinema in the middle of a movie... |
Yea, that's the bigger problem. | gx-x wrote: | | (I would pay like ~5$ to watch a movie on netflix or w/e but I don't have access to such a service) |
Buy a VPN subscription from the US and you can netflix. |
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djnforce9
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Joined: 18 Feb 2013
Posts: 65
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| Posted: Wed Dec 03, 2014 5:11 pm Post subject: They never learn.... |
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| Seems game companies (and especially their financial investors) never learn that DRM does NOT tackle piracy in the long run. All it does is delay the inevitable and potentially cripple the game for paying customers. I remember experiencing this with Sacred 2: Fallen Angel which was not compatible with Windows 7 at the time. Why? Because the DRM only ran properly on windows XP but the game itself worked great on Windows 7 if you cracked it. The above example is why DRM like this needs to die. I am quite sure going through a service like Steam or Origin is ample. It is also a form of DRM, but a much more consumer friendly option (provided you have a working net connection). |
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Csimbi
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| Posted: Wed Dec 03, 2014 6:30 pm Post subject: Re: They never learn.... |
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| djnforce9 wrote: | | I remember experiencing this with Sacred 2: Fallen Angel which was not compatible with Windows 7 at the time. Why? Because the DRM only ran properly on windows XP but the game itself worked great on Windows 7 if you cracked it. The above example is why DRM like this needs to die. |
I had such issues with quite a few games back in the SafeDisk/SecuROM days and contacted support every time.
The email was containing the same response almost every time: we can't officially recommend, but you may want to try no-cd patches. I got used to that and after I while I did not even bother contacting support, just went for the no-cd patches right away.
Anyhow. Why'd they bother with these DRMs when their own support unofficially recommends no-cd patches to get around them?
| djnforce9 wrote: | | I am quite sure going through a service like Steam or Origin is ample. It is also a form of DRM, but a much more consumer friendly option (provided you have a working net connection). |
What happens to your collection when Steam/Origin/youname it service goes out of business/someone buys it out/whatever happens? |
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gx-x
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| Posted: Wed Dec 03, 2014 6:56 pm Post subject: Re: They never learn.... |
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| Csimbi wrote: | | djnforce9 wrote: | | I remember experiencing this with Sacred 2: Fallen Angel which was not compatible with Windows 7 at the time. Why? Because the DRM only ran properly on windows XP but the game itself worked great on Windows 7 if you cracked it. The above example is why DRM like this needs to die. |
I had such issues with quite a few games back in the SafeDisk/SecuROM days and contacted support every time.
The email was containing the same response almost every time: we can't officially recommend, but you may want to try no-cd patches. I got used to that and after I while I did not even bother contacting support, just went for the no-cd patches right away.
Anyhow. Why'd they bother with these DRMs when their own support unofficially recommends no-cd patches to get around them?
| djnforce9 wrote: | | I am quite sure going through a service like Steam or Origin is ample. It is also a form of DRM, but a much more consumer friendly option (provided you have a working net connection). |
What happens to your collection when Steam/Origin/youname it service goes out of business/someone buys it out/whatever happens? |
What could they say? The alternative would be "our DRM doesn't support xyz OS" (basically they would be saying "our DRM is crap, sorry 'bout that") or to go for a crack, which pretty much is telling you the same but at least it's somewhat helpful if you never heard of "piracy".
As for steam/origin/we you;ll do the same thing, when they shutdown you will go and download the crack. |
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Csimbi
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| Posted: Wed Dec 03, 2014 8:57 pm Post subject: |
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No doubt.
But do these make me a pirate? |
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gx-x
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| Posted: Wed Dec 03, 2014 10:17 pm Post subject: |
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| Csimbi wrote: | No doubt.
But do these make me a pirate? |
do you own a parrot and a gun?!
but seriously - no. Personally I think that for something to be stolen, someone has to miss it. If I download a game, using my internet connection and store it on my HDD I am certain I haven't stolen anything. Did I break copyright rules? Sure, but it's not stealing. Do copyright rules even apply to an already cracked/hacked/altered content?! The one that altered it broke those rights for sure, but if someone downloads that content is he in violation of those rules too? He is not downloading original content that he has to pay for...hmm...confusing. |
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Csimbi
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Joined: 05 Mar 2010
Posts: 5355
Location: The bright side of the dark side
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| Posted: Thu Dec 04, 2014 12:30 am Post subject: |
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| gx-x wrote: | | Do copyright rules even apply to an already cracked/hacked/altered content?! |
The last time I checked the laws in Finland (before 2005 or so), it said that once a content protection mechanism has been removed, the content can no longer be considered protected. I.e. you're free to copy it.
All tools that help in removing those protection mechanisms are illegal however. (I guess you could still do it manually, lol.)
Ergo, once someone rips the CDs/DVDs or apply crack abroad, you are free to download it.
Out of curiosity, I wonder how these laws would apply for virtual machines (those illegal removal tools would be abroad and running on a computer abroad, content would be stored abroad, etc.). Cloud-based services are the current hype after all... |
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